So I'm banned from watchuseek... Again!

[cel4145]

Not at all. I'm pretty sure they're here. I think the only reason the Omega thread was shut down was because it was pointed out here.

In that case, maybe we need to talk about this WUS thread so they will put it out of its misery:
https://forums.watchuseek.com/f71/heads ... 03707.html

At best, it's a memorial to their community management incompetence as it limps along. If they are going to continue to operate with disrespect for others, it's in their best interest to shut it down and move on. Otherwise, when someone asks what happened to the deals, there will always be someone who made their way here to post in that thread and show the way. No need to get banned. All anyone has to do is use a free proxy server to hide their IP, and then use this site to get a temporary email address to create a new account on WUS: https://10minutemail.net/.

[Robotaz]

I’ve been thinking about this thread and some of the comments.

I’m considering selling a watch that many will like for a stupidly low price, where the winner of a contest gets to buy it.

How about a “say something nice about WUS so we can put this to bed” thread where the winner with the best comment (serious, not sarcastic) gets the deal.

How about the Devil Diver for $250? Barely used.

If anyone is interested I can start a new thread.


@robotazky

[squincher]

I’ve been thinking about this thread and some of the comments.

I’m considering selling a watch that many will like for a stupidly low price, where the winner of a contest gets to buy it.

How about a “say something nice about WUS so we can put this to bed” thread where the winner with the best comment (serious, not sarcastic) gets the deal.

How about the Devil Diver for $250? Barely used.

If anyone is interested I can start a new thread.


@robotazky

I'll give you $251 so no one has to make liar of themself by making up something nice.

[Robotaz]

I’ve been thinking about this thread and some of the comments.

I’m considering selling a watch that many will like for a stupidly low price, where the winner of a contest gets to buy it.

How about a “say something nice about WUS so we can put this to bed” thread where the winner with the best comment (serious, not sarcastic) gets the deal.

How about the Devil Diver for $250? Barely used.

If anyone is interested I can start a new thread.


@robotazky

I'll give you $251 so no one has to make liar of themself by making up something nice.

Just because mods and admins have behavioral issues doesn’t mean WUS isn’t a great resource. I’ve learned 90% of what I know about watches there. I have a lot more positive than negative to say about it.


@robotazky

[MoT]

Just because mods and admins have behavioral issues doesn’t mean WUS isn’t a great resource.

I agree, and I have said as much all along.

Just because I don't agree with the way certain things have been, and are being handled there doesn't change the fact that I believe there is no reason both sites can't be seen as useful resources.

[Dub Rubb]

I still frequent WUS every day. Lots of great people and tons of good info. I just don't post my deals there. No real animosity aside from how the deals thread was handled. But if that hadn't happened, we wouldn't have this tight knit brotherhood! Therefore, there is no more animosity, and I am very happy to have both of these places. While I feel a more personal connection to this forum, there is no doubt all of our roots stem from WUS, and for that alone, we should all be thankful.

Sent from my LG-M322 using Tapatalk

[yinzburgher]

No interest in any contest regarding WUS. And I actually really like saying nice things. There can also be virtue in saying things that are true (though it's not always helpful). What I will say is that I have no ill will towards anyone at WUS. That goes for the members and the moderators. Including the ones that deleted my posts. Including the ones who are playing dirty tricks. I try to have a short memory in these instances. My hope is that the two forums can move along and mostly ignore each other. Both forums have a lot of good to offer. But I also think that there is opportunity for the moderators over at WUS to learn something. And I seriously don't mean to sound patronizing. I say it as someone who has said and done some seriously **** things and learned from them. WUS is so huge that I think it is easy for them to think of some of their members as dispensible. And I think it's too easy for all involved to be nasty because we don't have to interact face to face. But also, if we're being real here, the worst thing that's happening in most cases here is shady moderating tactics, passive-aggressive behavior and remarks, unjustly denying people access to something they enjoy. Nobody is really getting hurt here. I think at the very least it is time to get over the small stuff, move past name-calling and dirty tricks, be happy that we have our own awesome forum and focus on making it even better. Also, as someone who is definitely guilty of trolling over on WUS even after we had our own place here, I'm done. No more. My apologies. Time for me to move on.

[cel4145]

I agree with everyone else. The community of people at WUS is great. It's unfortunate that the priority of those that own and administrate the WUS community is not the best interests of the community members, but rather how to make money off of them. VerticalScope has less accountability to the public than Facebook does (not big enough to get any media or government attention), so it's probably best to keep one's expectations as low as you would for how FB exploits and treats its members. The recent indications that WUS administrators are reading private messages would certainly seem to suggest that one should not hope for any better.

At some point, I believe that we--the global citizens of the Internet--will realize that most Internet communities need to become not-for-profit organizations. Granted, not-for-profits are not without their flaws, but at least not-for-profit bylaws can be written to prioritize the benefit of the community's members, as opposed to for-profit corporations entities that will always be about making money for corporate owners. Maybe at some point, MoT could become such a non-profit community.

[Robotaz]

My offer was tongue-in-cheek; basically paying people to stop crying about WUS. I do like the idea of turning WUS’s cynicism into a game we can laugh at and move on.

I don’t expect anyone to work for free. MoT is running a forum, not a charity, just like Vertical Scope. I hope he can pay for the place and earn extra income for his proprietary effort at starting this place. Experience, time, skill, and money were required to get it off the ground. Call me old fashioned, but I believe a man’s work and intellectual property deserve payment.

As for WUS, it’s sad they lurk here, but we’d be wise to drop it and let them see what a fun forum is for themselves.

I’m done on this one. Carry on.


@robotazky

[cel4145]

My offer was tongue-in-cheek; basically paying people to stop crying about WUS. I do like the idea of turning WUS’s cynicism into a game we can laugh at and move on.

I don’t expect anyone to work for free. MoT is running a forum, not a charity, just like Vertical Scope. I hope he can pay for the place and earn extra income for his proprietary effort at starting this place. Experience, time, skill, and money were required to get it off the ground. Call me old fashioned, but I believe a man’s work and intellectual property deserve payment.

As for WUS, it’s sad they lurk here, but we’d be wise to drop it and let them see what a fun forum is for themselves.

I’m done on this one. Carry on.


@robotazky

Do you belong to a trade organization in your field? That is most likely a not-for-profit organization, and notably, the people that run trade organizations are paid. The reason they are not-for-profits is so their primary mission is to serve their members. Thus, there is a lot more to not-for-profits than thinking of them all as simply "charities." In fact, an Internet enthusiast community would probably not be best setup as a charity under US law. IANAL, but it would likely be a 501(c)(7) Social or Recreational Club organization: https://www.upcounsel.com/types-of-nonprofits

I also think it helps to see that the main value and core intellectual property of an Internet community comes mainly from its members, not the person who purchases the domain and runs the website. There have certainly been many communities where private ownership resulted in an Internet community that kept the members' interests first and where the making of money was about funding the website. However, I am sure if you went through all of VerticalScopes 800 web communities, you would find many of them started out that way and then the original owner, for whatever reason (maybe they retired? passed away?), sold the rights to the domain name to a corporation. On the other hand, a not-for-profit legal structure could still provide for running the website and paying for the lights, while always guaranteeing the organization that owns the website would serve the community first and foremost.

[MoT]

I started this site so there would be a place people could continue to post deals in a way that they'd become used to, and so I could selfishly continue to collect stats. No more, no less.

This is a hobby for me, and one that I thoroughly enjoy. I am able to live vicariously through the stats I collect and by viewing all the great watches that you all are buying.

Running this place like a business is the furthest thing in my mind. I intended, and hope this place will remain a community, and I have experience building large online communities. I was one of the founding, and remain an administrator of http://www.lxforums.com. It was that site, and the community, not profit-driven, attitude built there that was the catalyst for the immense popularity of the 2005 and up Dodge Magnum/Charger/Challenger and Chrysler 300 vehicles. (There is an amusing story about how news we broke caused a run on AMG paddle shifters, depleted the NA inventory and caused MB to redesign them, but that's for another thread.)

That all being said I would be foolish if I behaved like I am immune to the reality that there are things that need to be paid for, and that my time has some value. Any monies donated through the donate link, raised through affiliate linking or by any other means are 100% rolled back into the operations, as they will continue to be in the future. If/when the site is successful enough to allow such things, I also intend to produce MoT merchandise as giveaways and further site fundraising. As I said, this place is a hobby. I want everyone to enjoy being a part of it as much as I am enjoying providing it.

(As altruistic as all that sounds, I'd be lying If I said I wouldn't accept a watch or two because of my involvement with this place. )

[Spirit of the Watch]

What exactly happened that ended things over at WUS?

All I remember from the old thread is some wierd old guy posting Chinese watches a lot and people getting angry about it so he only posts kind of a lot now.

Referral links to Massdrop causing a problem.

Also, occasional political talk.

None of which seemed that major or more than 1-2 users serious.

[BostonCharlie]

What exactly happened that ended things over at WUS?

All I remember from the old thread is some wierd old guy posting Chinese watches a lot and people getting angry about it so he only posts kind of a lot now.

Referral links to Massdrop causing a problem.

Also, occasional political talk.

None of which seemed that major or more than 1-2 users serious.

The old thread had gone somewhat off topic after the discovery that one user had been posting affiliate links (a practice the user immediately halted). The resulting discussion was amiable, thoughtful and interesting. A moderator showed up and warned us to get back on topic. Things were humming along when -- I think this was the proverbial straw -- somebody joked about a link being an affiliate link (it was funny, too). The mods locked the thread as punishment.

This isn't what started the migration, however. I believe it was the behavior of the WUS mods after they locked the thread that disillusioned a lot of folks. Since then, as MOT has grown and as WUS mods continued acting juvenile, I (and others) have discovered that the new deals forum is much nicer than the old deals forum. For me it is also the trippy feeling of living out Plato's Allegory of the Cave.

[househalfman]

I think what really annoyed people, and the reason for all the bickering, was the perpetrator's reason why he was sharing affiliate links: he didn't know that it was not allowed (or that it technically was not against written rules), many others were doing it, and that he wasn't making bank anyway.

The thread was closed with a warning not to create a new one without discussing with the mods first. A few folks clearly weren't paying attention, their threads were closed not long after being created.

A new thread was created by the mods several days later but the first few "deals" were shared using affiliate links. There were some questions on what made them affiliates, which then constituted as "questioning the moderation", which was and is considered a high crime in WUS.

[squincher]

I don't where you guys got your information. Bo clearly stated the thread was locked because it was getting too big and taking too long to load.

You don't think he was backtracking after doing something stupid, do you?